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Study shows rates of arrest are high — 18 Comments

  1. Joyce, you really hit the nail on its proverbial head with your question about WHY someone would even WANT to be a thug – I have often asked that question, myself.

    My personal expectations were that my child(ren) would come into this world as empathetic and compassionate individuals. I envisioned adults (my sons) as being conscientious about their surroundings, their communities,and their loved ones. “In tune” with the Universe, so to speak. Well………..with the dynamics within their family and the abuse that they endured and witnessed, neither of these people had a chance.

    To my knowledge, Mike has never even been charged with anything illegal, but his behaviors, decisions, and actions are all a pattern of an offender. So it is, and so it is. I can’t do anything to change him, fix him, or even help him. That time has long since passed, and anything that could possibly be done for him to change would have to be undertaken by him, alone.

    So it is.

  2. You know I knew the arrest rate was high, but I was actually shocked when I read this article.

    I know there have always been criminals in society, but I wonder what the arrest rate was 50 years ago? It seems like the media, entertainment media, high drug use, violent videos, violent video games, etc are fostering more crime in our society. Then if you consider the ones like your son Mike and though he is most likely a full blown psychopath he isn’t in prison and as far as I know from your stories hasn’t been arrested–but that doesn’t mean he hasn’t done some criminal acts.

    Most criminal acts, robberies etc are never solved, that’s a fact. Patrick broke in to dozens of homes and never got caught. He probably wouldn’t have gotten caught for robbing our friend’s business if I had not caught him with the loot and called the police.

  3. Joyce,
    interesting question why would a psychopath choose to become a thug when he could just as easily become president?

    I suppose it all boils down to whom they choose to victimize, who catches their attention.

  4. Well, some psychopaths don’t have the social polish, intelligence etc in order to enter the mainstream, so they rob liquor stores and beat their girlfriends, sire children or have children that they don’t take care of…but others like Patrick who are taught manners, who have high intelligence, etc. those can have a goal of high political office or high business success and aim for that goal and not settle for robbing liquor stores.

    What is odd to me and I still don’t understand, Patrick COULD have “been president” but he had NO aspirations to be anything but a thug. He wanted to impress folks, but the folks he wanted to impress were “common criminals” plus he didn’t have the will to WAIT to get the adrenalilne rush by being a “Bernie Maddof” or a “Bill Clinton”

    At the time all the worst of Patrick’s crimes started, my husband was giving Patrick flying lessons and most boys at that age would “kill” for a dad with a plane who would teach them to fly, and within a matter of weeks he could have been soloing and taking his dates on plane rides. So he had the opportunity for LEGITIMATE adrenaline rushes, he had the chance to be anything he wanted to be and the talent and IQ to do it….so what did he do. Steal, lie, drop out of school, take a gun to school and SHOW IT AROUND which fortunately other kids told the officer at the school about and the officer came to me. He also had a stolen motorcycle that he kept somewhere besides home but rode it to school, and ;posed on it for a photograph in the school parking lot.

    I don’t understand why if he wanted to “impress” his school chums he didn’t say, come on with me and we’ll go to the airport and my dad will give you a ride and soon I’ll have my license and I can take you for rides in my family’s plane. It didn’t then and it doesn’t now m ake any “sense” to me.

    And of course when he convinced his b rother to rent them an apartment, and his brother only had enough money for the deposit and first month’s rent, he blamed robbing as “having to find a way to support myself.” And as for me calling the police and turning him in for the robbery of our friend’s business…well THAT WAS AN UNFORGIVABLE BETRAYAL OF HIM…him stealing my car to haul the loot of course was okay as it was “necessary” for him to have a way to transport the loot as his only mode of transportation was a stolen motorcycle. But that’s the “logic” of a psychopath. It is never their fault.

    Three years later he would kill Jessica Witt for “betraying” him by telling he had stolen her grandfather’s credit card, so the girl had to die for “betraying” him. He obviously didn’t “get it ” though that NOT everyone of his former inmate friends would be okay with murder, so he told them, and even told Jessica’s roommate after he killed Jessica, I’m guessing because he thought they would see his “logic” and agree that Jessica deserved to die. For someone so smart, he sure was a dumb criminal.

  5. It’s crazy in a way, scary at the same time and just sad that the arrest rates are so high. I know of one name added to the list and in their case- why should they step up and get a job when others can, have and always will support them? Why buy the cow?

    It reminds me of someone else I know, who when I offered to help them get a job and give them a ride both ways, replied quite indignantly and so matter of fact, “Well I don’t want to work!” Well shite, neither do a lot of other people in the 95- world, but we do…

  6. I am not at all surprised by the criminal rate.Like Joyce mentioned in her article many of these offenders offend to survive because there are no proper programs in place.There are many homeless mentally challenged children because no one understands thier illness and are willing to put the funding in to give these children the twenty four hour support they need. Most of the FASD children I raised need something to keep there minds busy or they were thinking negative.Also society need to learn that forcing education on these children that are not able to comprehend also puts peer pressure on these children which turns them to drugs and alcohol.These children all have a hidden talent and if you find it and let them excel at it really helps. I personally have seen kids destroyed by forcing them to go to school when they can not handle school. I have saved kids by learning this hard lesson.I have had FASD children graduate but by the time these children are 12 I new who could handle it and who could not. Everyone of these children are different because of different brain cell damage. I learned that once these kids are push over the edge they become schizophrenic and surly do end up in Jail. I also had one after she left my home throw a brick through the window of a liquor store so she could have a roof over her head for the winter as winters are cold up here.Unfortunately she was one that was pushed over the edge and it was not safe to have her in our home especially with other children. That is also a big lose for me as we love her very much and was one of the most lovable children I ever had. She is unable to know the difference of a good choice from a bad choice.Although she is living in a adult world she is mentally five.She is all ready by age 25 has been in and out of jail several times since she left our home at 18.There are a lot of kids just like her in our jails with the right supports and not having negative family contact would have stayed a very innocent child.There are many more like her in the jail system but yet a sociopath that lives on the fine line of the law and is able to use the legal system to destroy people while they are laying on someones couch doing what they do best to stay there until he has eaten everyone up sucked them dry then moves on to the next victim.I do not wish to sound evil but the ones that ask to get caught like Joyce s son. is a blessing to the world because that is one less S path out there.I wish we could lock them all up.They are true criminals and most of them get away with it.

  7. Statistics show that 20-25% of criminals commit 80% of all the violent crime. That figure corresponds to the rate of psychopaths in felony criminals.

    While there are many mentally ill people in prison for violent and non violent crimes alike, there are also many homeless mentally ill, some survive on a small social security check and manage to survive on the street, and some panhandle and some steal. Some “self medicate” with drugs. It is very sad and our laws concerning these people are quite frankly in MY opinion totally UNREAL, and these people are not given the help they need unless they break the law then they get a jail or prison sentence but no help.

    When I worked at the Title XIX free standing psych clinic we dealt with this kind of chronic mentally ill clients, and I’ve read the jail records for some of them, and the ones who would come in monthly for their injections and we could get them into subsidized housing and some little bit of welfare and food stamps did fairly okay. There were also group homes for those who could not live independently where each had their own room and “life skills” were taught them by a rotating staff of caregivers. But of course there were always more who needed this than there were available slots for them.

    For those we could help it was very satisfying work for me, but for those we could not (for one reason or another) help, well it was heart breaking and frustrating.

    My neighbor down the road from me here at the farm became senile after his wife died, and was preyed upon by a “meth ho” who took all his money every month andc there was nothing that his daughter and I could do but keep an eye on him to make sure when the money was gone and the meth ho had departed til the next check came that he had food and water. We finally convinced the other neighbors NOT to give him cash because he did not need to be driving on the road…The man is deceased now, he finally got mentally bad enough that his daughter could have him confined to a locked nursing home and even the “meth ho” girlfriend died at less than 50 years of age from liver failure from the drugs and booze.

    As more and more young women use illegal drugs and alcohol while they are expecting there will be more and more brain damaged children born into this world with few chances for any kind of life. Grandmother I applaud you for taking in these children. My first cousin adopted one with severe FAS as well as other mental problems, but fortunately she is financially able to provide for him after she and her husband are gone. She even bought a dry cleaners where he could work, and has a small house on her property that is “his” house, and her natural son will continue to look after his brother after the parents are gone.

    The 20% of crimes committed by non psychopaths and by the mentally ill is not the biggest problem in our society though, but the 80% committed by the psychopaths like my son.

    I don[‘t think that Patrick was “asking” to get caught I think he REALLY thought that others would ADMIRE him for his crimes, even murdering Jessica, and he seemed to want to be ADMIRED by these folks, like if no one knew about his crimes then they weren’t “real” some how. Plus, as Dr. Hare says “the right and left sides of their brains don’t communicate” in other words the logical side and the emotional side work independently. So he let the EMOTION of wanting admiration over come the logic of “if I tell I’ll get caught” But I am just glad whatever the reason was he is at this point still in prison.

    • Joyce, absolutely I believe (and, know) that Mike has done things that were 100% illegal. And, the most insane thing is that I reported some of those crimes to authorities, and they didn’t have an inclination to even consider his actions for investigation. So be it. That was just one more thing that I came to accept: Law Enforcement doesn’t necessarily always enforce the law.

      With regard to the violence, today, I agree that media coverage probably adds a greater hype to criminal activities. News broadcasts are a flurry of drama/trauma from the most heinous crimes to stupid teenage pranks, they’re all harbingers of the “end times!” I remember how often the dipsh*t exspath’s father would literally say, “We’re living in the ‘end times,'” and he was (and, likely still is) convinced that the world is going to end, any minute. There have always been criminals, and there always will be, sad to say.

      I got into a discussion with Bob, the other day, that made him uncomfortable enough to want to end the conversation. I told him that I no longer believe that “all people are good,” or that “everyone deserves a second chance.” He felt that my view was “dark” and unsettling. Well, BOTH exspaths did things that were against written laws – shoving a loaded gun in someone’s face is illegal, and so is forging someone’s signature. Neither of these people were ever arrested, charged, or prosecuted for their actions.

      So, there’s “What Should Be,” and then there’s “What Is.” These two things rarely cross paths, and I’ve come to accept that this is true and non-negotiable. I don’t like that it’s true, but I can’t change this fact, damitol!!! LOL

      • Truthy, the LIES we are taught about “there is good in everyone” and “everyone deserves a second (or 100th) chance” and many other myths and lies that we believe make us want to believe them, and to “forgive” people who have done some really nasty things.

        I like the example of Ted Bundy, the serial killer—they really do not know how many women he raped, tortured and killed–when he was not killing, he was “a great guy” and a “good friend” to his friends. So even the WORST of the monsters in this world can DISPLAY “kindness, goodness etc” at times but that does NOT MAKE THEM LESS OF A MONSTER.

        I know your son Bob wants to believe that his brother Mike has some good in him, even though he is like Ted Bundy in that part of the time he is doing NASTY THINGS (maybe not killing but nasty none the less) so Bob gives validity to only the “good” things Mike says and does, and “blows off” those nasty things even if he knows they are true. It is how we cope with the pain when we realize someone we love isn’t “good all the time” and does nasty things.

        I had the same problem with my oldest son Andrew…he didn’t betray me EVERY time…just sometimes. But I finally took off the blinders when he blew his 200th “last chance” and LIED to me again. I realized that the times he was “good” and “caring” were there, but when he wanted to do something “bad” (lie or break agreements) then he would do so and I am so not tolerating lies any more. A lie is a choice. I dont’ care what you lie about, how big or how little it is, I will not associate with people who lie to me. It was very painful to walk through the fire of finally realizing and accepting that Andrew was not the kind of man I could trust 100% of the time. Yeppers, accepting what IS rather than staying in DENIAL is painful. But to me the long term effects of DENIAL are worse.

  8. Phoenix, there are some people so completely lazy that my step father said “were so lazy they would find a pregnant woman to marry so they didn’t have to do anything to have children” Yea, THAT’s pretty lazy. But you know, I have known some folks just about that lazy. And some how they feel ENTITLED to have others provide for their living and their needs.

    I’ve always been very independent and didn’t want to be “beholden” to anyone else so I didn’t ask for or take money from others, even when I needed it. I worked for a living, when I was in college I cleaned other people’s houses to get money. I did all kinds of odd jobs but I supported myself except when I was married and my kids were young, for about 3 years I was a stay at home mom. Then my husband left us high and dry and BROKE and I lived in my truck with my kids and the cat for 3 months til I could arrange better. I’m a survivor, not a mooch.

    Yea, Phoenix, I let a woman who was living in her small motor home (lilke on a very small pick up truck) so she could have a safe place to park and offered to help her get a job in the little town near us and she could have ridden to and from work with my son andrew. Nope, NO interest in getting a job. Then a woman offered her a job of editing some writings and she could do it at her computer, didn’t even have to leave home, but NOPE, no desire to do anything to make money. She kept trying to con me for first one thing, then another, and you know…I asked her to leave because “it isn’t working out” and you would have thought I had stuck pins in her eye balls, she went on and on about how I HAD ABUSED HER while she was here and now I was throwing her out. I gave her $150 to make sure she had enough gas to get across the state line and sent her on her way.

  9. This is the one my daughter has and when it was written that some of them are even to lazy to have sex.That is him and of course it is her fault. He gets his jollies but watching porn and overestimating in front of her.It is sick stuff like this I can not rap my head around. I never thought she of all people would take that from anyone.Mind control is one wicked thing.

  10. Grandmother, seeing ones we love (our children or anyone else) behaving in a nasty way, living with someone who is highly psychopathic etc. is painful, but just as I kept my mouth shut for 7 years while my son was married to a woman I knew was a psychopath, I blamed HER for their financial problems, not paying bills etc. and HE blamed her as well, but in the end, when the TRUTH CAME OUT, it was HIM as much or more than her.

    I had used the “convenient” truth about her being a psychopath for his actions. That HE was only doing what SHE wanted him to….but the TRUTH is that HE was the one who was financially irresponsible. Plus, he had no gratitude for anything that was done to “help” him.

    It is painful to SEE and ACCEPT the truth that our own child is not what we wish they were, and that the person they are with is the problem. Your daughter is with this guy for some reason, and as you said yourself she was selfish before she was with him, so I think that the problem is NOT JUST HIM, I think it is her and him together. SHE is using the kids to hurt you, not just he is using the kids to hurt you. So that tells me that both your daughter and her partner are both high in psychopathic, self centeredness and that they together make a worse team than either of them alone, but they are both TOXIC to you, and you can h ope and dream that she will “come around” if she leaves him is a fantasy that is painful to give up. But DENIAL of the truth doesn’t change the truth. As long as we maintain that denial it may seem it is less painfull than accepting the truth but it keeps us from ever really healing. We must accept what IS the truth, rather than keep on hoping for something that will never come true. God bless.

  11. Joyce for some reason, reading the first part of your comment, struck a chord with me. For the first time, I have thought of how my mom must feel and have felt for the past XX years that I have been with this scummy life/energy sucking dredge. I know that my mom knows the truth, has seen me stand up to what has been laid down on my path in life and knows I will get there someday on the road to Healing.

    She has always had my back and knew when to help or step back and effectively say “No”. I have always thanked her as best I could, but sometimes it never felt like it was ‘enough’. Some days I wonder if it will ever be enough.

    DGma- you would be surprised what people will tolerate, ignore or otherwise put up with, if they think they need someone around for whatever convoluted reason. The details of my experience would blow your mind. The level these people will sink to, the lengths they will go to, to lie, cheat or steal- we don’t ‘get it’ because we aren’t wired like that. We don’t think like they do. Thank Heavens for that!!!

  12. DGrandmother,
    I’ve also experienced what Phoenix and Joyce describe about not wanting to believe that a loved one is responsible for their own bad behavior. We blame it on their bad choice of companionship and believe that if only they would choose better friends, they’d behave better. But the fact remains, that they were bad before they hooked up with their evil masters. They were always destined to become minions because they were empty inside.

    And I also agree with Phoenix about what they will do to keep us around as long as they think we could be useful. She has you around as a backup, for those times when her spath abandons her. But he is still her first choice in loyalty and she’ll throw you under the bus if he only says the word.

    As difficult as it is to accept this, I can guarantee you that continued denial is even more painful, as betrayal after betrayal wears you down into the ground. Acceptance sets us free from betrayal because we’ve opened our eyes to the truth.

    The one good thing I can say about manipulators and betrayers, is that they are all alike deep down. When you see the behaviors which reveal them, you don’t have to doubt that the other behaviors will follow. It’s always just the tip of the iceberg. They’re like cookie-cutter replicas of each other.

  13. Accepting the TRUTH is never easy when it is an evil truth about someone we love, and not every person who does something evil totally lacks a conscience. Conscience is like “tall” or “short” it has upper and lower limits with most folks in the middle. I have a conscience and I have empathy and yet I’ve done some things I knew were wrong…every human in the world has done so. We are people, we are human, we make bad decisions, poor choices, etc. but it is the PATTERN of this bad behavior.

    For example Judas (the apostle that betrayed Jesus) was the “banker” for the group and the Bible tells us he had pilfered some money right along, and then for whatever reason he decided to turn Jesus in for the reward, which was the “average price” of a slave, 30 pieces of silver.

    But then, when he saw what the RESULT was going to be, the death of Jesus he tried to get a “do over” and threw the money down, but the “holier than thou” crooked religious leaders wouldn’t put it back into the Temple treasury since it was now “blood money” and used it to buy a field to bury people without money to bury themselves.

    Judas hung himself because he did have a conscience and realized what an EVIL thing he had done. Personally, though the Bible doesn’t say so, I think Judas was aware that he had sent the Son of God to die and couldn’t live with having done such an EVIL thing was why he killed himself. So as bad as he was, he still knew right from wrong and in the end when he did something REALLY bad he turned to the only thing he could think of, suicide.

    And when you think about it, I don’t doubt that Jesus knew all along that Judas was stealing a bit of money here and there, and He knew the night that Judas would betray him. But I also believe that Jesus loved Judas, just like we love our betrayers, and the thing is that IT ALWAYS HURTS WORSE WHEN A LOVED ONE BETRAYS US OR DOES SOMETHING TRULY EVIL.

  14. Joyce, you wrote, “…IT ALWAYS HURTS WORSE WHEN A LOVED ONE BETRAYS US OR DOES SOMETHING TRULY EVIL.” That is the most painful betrayal of all – being duped by someone that we love(d). Spot-on.

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